Have questions about sourdough? This comprehensive troubleshooting guide offers practical tips and tricks to achieve a bubbly, active sourdough starter.
Without a doubt, the most intimidating aspect of sourdough baking is understanding its key element: the starter.
What is a sourdough starter you ask?
Simply put: a starter is a live fermented culture of flour and water.
Once it becomes bubbly and active a small portion is used to make your bread dough rise- no commercial yeast is required. It’s a technique that can be traced back thousands of years when instant yeast was not yet available to bakers.
Doesn’t sound too scary, right?
But there’s a catch…
A starter is not just this “thing” you create and walk away from forever.
It must be kept alive and well with additional feedings (flour and water) to keep it bubbly and active. Remember, it’s a living culture which must be cared for with intent. Otherwise, your bread won’t rise. Think of it like a pet that needs to be fed daily, or a house plant that needs water and a sunny window.
At its core, sourdough is about understanding and committing to an ongoing relationship.
As with all relationships however, there lies a bit of uncertainty.
You might ask yourself: “Am I doing this right? Why does my starter look different than yours? Why is it taking forever to rise? Is it dead?”
That’s why I’ve put together this article for you.
Most of the information is already covered in my book Artisan Sourdough Made Simple, but I’ve included additional details to answer any questions you might have and to open up the topic for discussion.
Two quick things before you begin:
1.) To streamline the process, this post assumes you have a working knowledge of a 100% hydration starter, made from equal parts regular wheat flour and water by weight. This is the most common type of sourdough starter. If you don’t have a starter, try my Beginner Sourdough Starter Recipe.
2.) This post is also very comprehensive. To avoid losing your mind as you digest the details, take your time and read through it a few times until the aha moment strikes!
Because eventually, it will…
Troubleshooting Your Sourdough Starter
1.) Why Won’t My Starter Rise?
Ahh yes… the million dollar question. It’s like asking: “Why won’t my 2-year-old sleep through the night?”
Because a sourdough starter is a living culture, like children of a certain age, they will definitely share some similarities. Each one will have their own unique personality and the “one size fits all approach” doesn’t always work.
Some bakers use science to explain these personality differences and others observe, follow their intuition and allow the starter to teach them. I implement both techniques.
Keep in mind, when troubleshooting your sourdough starter, it’s usually a combination of factors. In my experience, the rise time is based on temperature, ingredients, feeding frequencies, type of flour & the quantity of flour used.
Temperature
Starters love warm environments. The warmer the spot the quicker it will rise. But realistically, finding a warm spot can be challenging especially when baking in the winter. The ideal temperature is somewhere between 75-85 F.
Here are a few things you can do:
Try storing your starter in a cozy cabinet. It’s warm, draft free, and I have to say, my personal starter does really well in this snug little habitat. Experiment with a cabinet that’s near your stove for extra warmth.
Another option is to wrap the starter jar in a heating pad. One of my kombucha readers (Hi, Melanie!) suggested this tip and it’s very clever. The heating pad maintains the starter at an approximate temperature which can be adjusted to your liking.
A proofing box can also be used to control the temperature. This is the one I use, which is great for your dough too (it FOLDS FLAT!).
If you don’t have a proofing box, place your starter in the oven (turned off) with the light on. But please make sure to keep an eye on it and turn the light off, if necessary. It can get very hot in there! Another makeshift proofing box option is to use your microwave; just place the starter inside (turned off) with the light on.
Finally, try using warm water in your feedings. Around 80-90 F is a good temperature.
Note: regarding temperature, if your starter is exceptionally strong and vibrant, it will have no problem rising in warm OR cold environments, even in the fridge. My starter is a workhorse and will rise ANYWHERE. This is because it’s mature, well fed and cared for starter. Keep this in mind as you continue to develop a relationship with your personal starter.
Ingredients
A sourdough starter is made from flour and water. For best results, always use quality ingredients.
For the flour, please use something that is unbleached, unbromated, and does not contain chemicals.
Most non-organic U.S. flours, including my preferred brand King Arthur Flour, are enriched with vitamins and minerals including iron, folic acid and other vitamins. This is okay to use. I also like Trader Joe’s all-purpose flour for feedings.
However, it’s important to note that not all flours perform the same. Flour from the UK is going to have different enzyme and mineral levels than flour from the U.S., Japan, Australian etc. Even organic flours perform differently.
That’s why when troubleshooting your starter, it’s best not switch back and forth between brands at first. It’s too confusing and you won’t know where you went wrong. Stick to one brand, try to rule out additional factors that might be giving you trouble, and then make changes from there.
For the water, try using filtered or bottled water to avoid any trace chemicals or chlorine if you think it’s having a negative effect on the rise. I don’t have to do this at home, my tap is fine.
Feeding Frequencies
Ever have those days where you’re just ravenous?
Starters can be ravenous too. If at one point your starter was all bubbly and happy, and now it’s not rising anymore, it’s possible that it needs a few extra feedings to boost the yeast development. Assuming you understand how temperature and ingredients can effect the rise of your starter, try feeding it 2x per day and see what happens.
Also, if your starter has been stored in the fridge for a while, it’s going to need several feedings at room temperature to become bubbly. Have patience!
2.) What Type Of Flour Can I Feed It With?
Feed your starter with the same flour from which it’s made.
Now, let me just clarify: every baker has their own way of feeding their starter. And one method is not necessarily better than the next (just different).
To cut through the noise with reliable results, feed your starter with the same flour that’s in the jar. For example, if your starter is made with all purpose flour, feed it with all purpose flour. If it’s made with rye flour, feed it with rye flour. Easy.
By doing so, you’ll establish a consistent feeding routine and the rise time will become more predictable. Think about it this way: how would your dog feel if you fed him a different type of dry food each week? Starters are no different!
3.) How Much Flour and Water Does My Starter Need?
For a 100% hydration starter, feed it following a 1:1:1 ratio by weight.
For example, if you have 30 g of starter in the jar, feed it with 30g of flour + 30g of water. If you have 60g of starter, feed it with 60g of flour + 60g of water. Please use a kitchen scale for this! You can easily scale the initial starter quantity up or down, depending on how much you want to maintain now or in the future.
Again, every baker has a different method, but following a 1:1:1 ratio by weight will get you reliable results. Your starter will rise more predictably, and if you’re lucky, it will stay at its peak height for quite a while before it collapses.
4.) I Created a Starter Following the Instructions in Your Book… It Used to Be Bubbly, But Now Nothing’s Happening? Did I do Something Wrong? Should I Start Over?
Believe it or not, this is 100% normal.
Typically, when creating a starter from scratch, you’ll see bubbles on the surface around Day #3. When you start feeding it with flour and water on Day #4 and beyond, the bubbles may or may not appear as quickly. It makes sense to think that something’s wrong! But don’t panic.
In order to cultivate and develop the yeast within your starter, you need to feed it for several days in order to see results. The process can be unpredictable, and each person you talk to will have a different experience based on their personal situation and environment. It’s easy to get caught up and compare, doubt yourself, and think it’s not working.
So, should you start the whole process over?
No! Continue to follow the instructions in the book, but make sure to read this post a few times, including Sections 1-3 to familiarize yourself with possible troubleshooting factors. If you’re still stumped, please be patient and continue to feed your starter until it bubbles and doubles in size. Eventually, you will see results. It just takes time.
5.) What Type of Container of Jar Should I use for My Sourdough Starter?
I wrote a whole post on this. Click here.
6.) Does the Starter Jar Need To Be Airtight?
The jar or container can be airtight or covered loosely; it’s your choice.
If it’s airtight, just make sure the jar is large enough to accommodate the starter’s growth as it begins to rise (at least double in size). Otherwise it will burst through the jar.
If you choose a loose cover such as a cloth or something else that’s breathable, and a skin forms on the surface, that means too much air is getting into your starter. It’s not the end of the world if you see this; just peel it off and/ or choose an airtight lid instead.
7.) What Is That Dark, Smelly Liquid On My Starter?
It’s called hooch which is an indication that your starter needs to be fed.
Don’t worry, it’s not dead. Just exhausted. This liquid is something you’ll see regularly, either on the surface of your starter or even within the culture itself (as pictured above), so get used to it! Because the liquid is unsightly and smells like gym socks, I pour it off with some of the discolored starter underneath and feed it right away. That’s all you have to do.
PS: hooch is not mold.
8.) What Should My Starter Smell Like?
First all all, your starter shouldn’t smell too vinegary, like gym socks, or nail polish remover. If it does, it just needs to be fed. Don’t freak out over this too much. At some point your starter will smell like this.
On the other hand, when your starter is in good shape it should smell fresh, fruity and yeasty.
So, what does that even mean?
Fresh, fruity, and yeasty aromas will vary from starter to starter. Some will smell like toasted coconuts and pineapple, others will smell like apple cinnamon. It’s actually very interesting to note all of the differences. Don’t worry if yours just smells tangy and not very “exotic.” Totally normal. The aroma all depends on what’s in the jar and how it’s cared for.
9.)What Happens If There’s Mold Growing On My Starter?
If you see mold, get rid of the entire starter!
In all my years of baking, I’ve never had a problem with mold. That doesn’t mean it can’t happen to you. In fact, several of you have emailed me regarding mold (oddly enough you’re all from eastern Australia. Weather issues?).
Mold can occur on the surface of the starter or on the jar itself. Its appearance can range from white and fluffy, to dark greenish brown, and even pink.
What gives?
Here’s what I know about mold: mold spores are everywhere. And it takes a perfect storm of variables (food, temperature, and water) to populate its growth. So, think about your current environment: is your starter jar near a fruit bowl (food source)? Is your current climate on the humid side (mold loves this kind of weather)? Are you using tap water (where trace chemicals and chlorine can be found)?
Because we all live in different environments it’s hard to pinpoint the exact cause. But if you can troubleshoot any of the above, it might lead you in the right direction. Consider moving your starter to a different room if you think location is part of the issue.
Paired with the variables above, mold can also occur if your starter hasn’t been fed often enough. Consider feeding it more frequently. This will keep the naturally occurring bacteria fresh and happy.
And finally: Sometimes mold can occur when something else lands in the jar. Last summer, a fly got stuck in my starter and the whole thing turned pink (not the fly, the starter). I’m not sure if the pinkish color was true mold or just a result of the unfortunate casualty. Either way, it’s something to pay attention to.
10.) How Do I Get Rid Of Fruit Flies?!
Short answer: you can’t.
When summer rolls around, get used to seeing fruit files because they LOVE sourdough starters. Love. Love. Love. It’s hard to prevent a fleet of flies swarming the jar but there’s a few things you can do.
First, make sure your starter is not near any fruit (for obvious reasons). Second, just relocate it. Sometimes, I keep mine in my bedroom and completely out of the kitchen where the main food sources reside- my husband thinks this is totally weird. Third, keep the lid on. This will not keep out the flies completely but it will help especially after you’ve moved the jar out of the kitchen.
If you have additional ideas on this one, I’m all ears! Please read the comment section below; you guys have THE BEST tips.
11.) Can My Starter Be Used With Gluten Free Flours To Make GF Bread?
Short answer: NO
Most sourdough starters are made from wheat flour and water, so therefore it contains gluten. If you want to bake gluten free sourdough you’ll need a gluten free starter. Remember that. I get many emails asking if my starter can be used to create gluten free sourdough, and it’s just not the real deal.
12.) If I Forget To Feed My Starter, Is It Going To Die?
Short answer: NO
No matter what I tell you here, the first time your starter gives you trouble, or it’s taking forever to rise, or whatever, you’re going to think it’s dead. I guarantee it. The Internet has scared people into thinking if your starter doesn’t rise instantly with a trillion bubbles on the surface, it’s completely broken and will never be usable again. EVER.
Please have a little faith. I have a starter that’s been siting in my fridge for over 1 year, unfed. I forgot it was even in there. After transferring it to a new jar, feeding it for several days in a warm spot, and just being patient, guess what?! It was still ALIVE!!! That’s all you have to do if you suspect your starter needs a little love. Starters are resilient creatures which require practice and patience.
Which brings me to my last point (hooray!)…
13.) Be Patient!
This is THE hardest tip to follow. But it’s undoubtedly the most important.
Who has patience these days when we have access to whatever we want on demand? Sourdough will teach you all about patience whether you like it or not. You can’t rush it. There are no shortcuts. No cheat sheets. Again, like parenting, eventually your 2-year-old will sleep through the night.
So, please read through these tips slowly and carefully and see what troubleshooting factors apply to your personal situation. Some days you’ll have a beautiful bubbly starter and other days it will act like a diva. And just remember: it’s usually a combination of factors that contribute to sourdough starter issues. Your starter behaves this way not to make your life miserable; it just wants you to pay attention. Take your time, feed it a million times if you have to, move it to a warmer spot, and just honor the relationship. It’s the only way you’ll learn.
My intent with this post was to include enough information to satiate your questions, without making you feel exhausted.
Believe me, this topic can go on for ages- there’s just so many scenarios. Feel free to comment below with additional thoughts and tips. Based on your feedback, I will make periodic updates to keep this post fresh and relevant! Happy baking, friends :)
Tom says
Thanks for the very comprehensive troubleshooting guide!
A tip/observation I wanted to pass along that I struggled with is the particular yeast that I have absolutely hates too much water. I am using an organic flour so I’m not sure if that has anything to do with my results, but I found that my starter was MUCH happier once I halved the amount of water that went into its feeding.
Good luck out there everyone!
Emilie Raffa says
Tom, this is SO true. Because flour is like a sponge, and different brands/varieties absorb water at different rates, feeding ratios are just guidelines. If your starter prefers more flour, then add it! Great observation.
Phyllis says
Day 8, doubled in size, but did not pass the float test. Do I need to start feeding twice a day? Help!
Emilie Raffa says
Hi there! Did you do the test when the starter doubled? Or sometime afterwards when it collapsed? It should be done when it has doubled in size at peak height in order to pass.
Andrea says
Hi there!!!!!
Currently on third week of feeding the starter, I see small bubbles but not active bubbling and I also did the float test dint float yet. batter a little looses tho What do I do. Please help.
Thank you
Shelly says
I’m in the exact same boat!
Jeff says
Great post Emilie. Day 3 of my first ever starter and I had just said to my wife (who is suspicious of this new house guest) “I think I killed it yesterday when the scale maxed out and I put too much water in. I probably need to start over.” You have emboldened my patience and confidence. Thank you! Onward to bread!!! Woohooo!
Emilie Raffa says
Go Jeff! Yay! :)
Steve Dunne says
Hi Emilie
Thanks for a very helpful website!
My starter is now a couple of months old and appears to be working well. It is 35g seed from previous, 35g Rye flour, 35g wholemeal flour, 110g water. It makes great sourdough bread!
Daytime at 78-80°F it takes 7 hours to rach peak at just more than double, then falls back. At night, cooler, it takes 10 hours or so to do the same. I feed it every time it reaches peak, 3 times per day – largely because I don’t know any better. My question – what happens to the starter efficacy if I don’t feed before it falls? Does it lose vigour after falling, and need extra care to get back to its best behaviour?
I bake 3-4 times a week, so using the fridge is not necessary – and it appears that the starter needs nursing back to health after being in the fridge (so woulkd I, I suppose!), but does the same principle apply when I skip a feed?
Sooy to ask a dumb question, But I reaaly don’t know, and all I read seems to skip over this.
Thanks again,
Steve.
Emilie Raffa says
Hello Steve! Great questions. Not dumb at all. In short: the more often you feed your starter, the stronger it will be. If you’re currently feeding it 3x/ day at room temperature to bake 3-4x a week- I’m sure it’s exceptionally vibrant.
To answer your questions: all starters will lose strength after they fall, but not so much that they won’t work altogether (if fed again soon after). The amount of time it will take to perk back up will vary; in your case, because your starter is well fed, I imagine it won’t take very long outside of your usual timeframe given the weather isn’t too cold. You just have to keep an eye on it and see what it does.
And yes: the same principle applies to feeding a starter coming out of the fridge. In my experience, they will take a little longer to rise and bubble again, perhaps with a few additional feedings because they are colder.
Overall, when in doubt, just keep feeding it.
Hope this helps :)
Courtney says
I started my starter with gold medal all purpose flour and didn’t realize it was bleached. I made my first loaf with King Arthur bread flour and it went great! But can I switch the flour I feed the starter to King Arthur all purpose with no problems?
Emilie Raffa says
Absolutely! You can switch. It might take a day or two for your starter to adjust, but you don’t have to stick with the same brand forever.
Heather says
Hi Emilie, Thanks for your awesome site and information. I started a brand new starter that was fantastically bubbly and big the day after the first feeding, and it hasn’t bubbled or doubled since (8 days later). I fed it every 24 hours at first and for the last 2 days, feeding every 12 but it still hasn’t budged. Could I have used it after day 1? Thanks!
Heather
Emilie Raffa says
You’re welcome, Heather! This can happen from time to time. However, your starter definitely wasn’t ready to use after day 1. Now that the weather is getting colder, make sure it’s rising in a warm spot. Additionally, try adding more flour to make a thicker starter (the exact amount doesn’t matter, just go by eye) and/or use 50/50 white and whole wheat flour for a boost. Hope this helps!
RACHEL GERSON says
Mine is doing the exact same thing! It was huge and bubbly overflowing my pint jar on the third day, then it fell overnight and didn’t grow at all after feeding on day 4 and only a few bubbles. Now we are on Day 5. It seems a little runny and flat. Maybe I will try adding a little whole wheat
Melanie says
Oh no!! I forgot to remove half my starter this morning (2hours ago). I added the daily flour and water on top.
Is there something I can do??
Emilie Raffa says
Hi Melanie! Not to worry. We discard for two reasons: to refresh the acidity levels and to control the overall growth in size (if you did not discard, your starter would grow out of control and become cumbersome to maintain). Just keep it as is for now, paying more attention to the texture- keep it on the thicker side if using all purpose flour for best results.
Gina says
Hi there – you mentioned that you should feed your starter with some type of flour that you began with, However your starter recipe calls for wheat flour which I did, and then you instruct in the same post to feed with all purpose flour. Can you clarify that? Thanks so much!
Steve says
All purpose flour is a wheat flour, just not as higher protein level as a bread flour. If you have used all purpose just don’t start adding spelt or rye to it.
Frustrated says
I’m getting so frustrated with my starter! Floated yesterday and I fed it last night so I could make bread today but nothing!! How does anyone time this??? I can’t just watch it all day to see when it grows.
Emilie Raffa says
Hi there! Don’t give up! Here’s the issue: When your starter floats, it needs to be used right away (give or take) to make bread dough. If you wait until the next day, it won’t be active enough and will fail the float test without an additional feeding. Does that make sense? If you want to make dough in the morning, feed your starter at night the day before to give it a boost. In the morning, feed it again and wait for it to bubble and double in size. PS: once you figure out how long it takes for your starter to rise you can adjust your feeding schedule to make dough when you want.
Kelly Saltzman says
Thanks so much Emilie! I am so excited about my beginner sourdough and creating something from scratch. I am on day 9, and I still don’t have A LOT of bubbles, just a couple small ones at the top, the smell is still a little sour and I have tested if it floats in water, it’s a no go. I am still consistently removing 50% of the starter, and adding 60gs of flour (the same that I started with) and 60gs of water. It currently ways about 225gs. It is very wet, like loose pancake batter.
Do you have any suggestions? Should I try starting over?
Jacquelyn Miller says
I’m having the same problem!
Emilie Raffa says
Hi Kelly! Yes: add more flour. Especially if you’re using all purpose flour for the feedings. Flour is like a sponge and they absorb at different rates. So, if the texture is too loose or wet- this is not your fault. It just needs to be thicker. Add about 1 tbsp. of flour at a time until the texture becomes very thick like Greek yogurt. As it sits at room temperature, the flour will hydrate and the texture will become slightly thinner. And of course, continue to let it rise in a warm spot for best results.
Srijana says
Hi Emily
Thank you for amazing post with detailed and cleared information. Today is day 7 for me and my starter also does not look thick. So for two days I have been feeding every 12 hours 50gm flour and 50ml water. To make it thick do I need to add more flour and less water or should I go with same ratio until it is ready? Please help
Srijana
Emilie Raffa says
Yes! Just add more flour. It’s totally flexible and adding more won’t hurt it. :)
Megan says
Thank you so much for your informative article. I made a sourdough started two weeks ago from your instructions and it was rising and doubling in size for the first week. But now It never rises or bubbles and I can not figure out what to do to get it stronger. I am doing the 1:1:1 ratio for feeding and trying to keep it warm in the oven with the light on for small stretches of time. Thanks!
Emilie Raffa says
Hi Megan! This will happen from time to time… try increasing your flour ratio (1:2:2), especially if using all purpose flour for your feedings. The texture should be thick. This is what I do in the warm summer months to give it a boost and it helps tremendously. :)
Linda says
Hi,
I have just started my starter after reading your post. I started with 40g flour and 40g water. There was rising on day 3 but no rise after day 4 and i can see hooch on top a few hours after feeding. However, i made a mistake on day 4 as i did not discard half of the starter, instead i stir the hooch in and feed with 40g flour and 40g water. On day 5, still no rise but hooch on top. I discarded the hooch and half of the starter in the jar and continue feeding with 40g flour and 40g water. Should i start again as i mix up the ratio? Or should i add more flour and water?
Mira says
Hi! I am on day 3 of my starter and there are many bubbles throughout but no hooch. Is this a problem?
Emilie Raffa says
Not at all! Sometimes you’ll see hooch and sometimes you won’t- it all depends :)
Bec says
Hello! I stumbled on your blog and am so grateful. I had been feeding my starter with 1 cup flour, 1/2 cup starter and 1/2 cup water. Over the months it has gotten REALLY thick. This morning I fed using your instructions to weigh the ingredients and used the 1:1:1 method. It still seems really thick so I added a bit more water to make the consistency more like batter. I hope my gut instinct was correct on the additional water. FYI, I bought your book in hopes of making a better loaf. Mine past loaves have been pretty dense using the thick starter and maybe that is why.
Emilie Raffa says
Always go with your gut. Here’s why: flour is like a sponge. And because of this, your starter will look different on different days. When it’s humid, the texture will be more runny… when it’s dry, the texture might be a bit thicker. So, while ratio’s are certainly helpful to establish guidelines, you’ll need to make your own adjustments based on your specific conditions. This is why observing the texture of a starter is sometimes more beneficial than the actual quantity of flour and water that goes into it.
Julia says
Hi Emilie! I’ve had a bit of a hard time getting a starter started, but now I have one that seems like it’s on the right track. For the past week, I have been feeding it twice a day, with a 1:1:1 ratio (before that, I don’t think I was feeding it enough). It smells great, and there are small bubbles on the surface. It seems like it’s a good consistency, but it has never risen. I’m using unbleached AP flour, warm water, and keeping it in a closet. Do you think I should change anything I’m doing or just wait it out a bit more? Thanks so much!
Smarika says
Hey emilie.. i have liquid at the bottom of the strater.. i used whole wheat flour with 1:1 ratio. What should i do??.. feed it or leave it.. it is day 2
Emilie Raffa says
Hi there! You can leave it for now and discard the liquid the following day. It doesn’t really matter :)
Isabelle says
Hi Emilie!
I have a quick question about my starter. I keep it in the fridge and feed it on Mondays, and it was pretty active last month, it would double in size in less than 2 hours after feeding. I might’ve slacked off a little one week and fed it after 9 days rather than 7, and the next time i fed it was on Tuesday (8 days later). I’ve been feeding it on Tuesdays for the past 3 weeks, and it rises so slowly now, it barely doubles after 4 hours. How often/when should I feed it to make it more active? Could I feed it once a day and still keep it in the fridge, or would I have to leave it on the counter? Thank you! :)
Esther says
Hi, I followed your recipe in making my starter. For the first feeding , it’s 60g starter + 60g flour + 60g water. So it’s 1:1:1.
But the next day it’s 90g starter + 60g Flour + 60g water , so it’s no longer 1:1:1 right ?
Same applies to day 3-6, since the total starter left in jar is getting more and more , and I only discard half. Correct me if I’m wrong, thanks :)
Emilie Raffa says
Eshter, you are correct! And PS: the ratio when creating a starter is different than the 1:1:1 ratio for ongoing feedings discussed in this post. :)
Veronica says
Hi Emilie!
I have been following your beginner sourdough starter method, and I have a question that I haven’t been able to find in the hundreds of comments :) On day 9, my started finally started to rise just a tiny bit, but it happened very slowly. Yesterday evening was day 10, and I fed it at the same time I always do- 5 pm. I woke up to find that it had risen significantly. It is happening really slowly because when I went to bed last night, 7 hours after feeding it, it had risen very little. But by the time I woke up, it had almost doubled. And now, it is JUST NOW starting to fall- 17 hours after feeding it! Because I couldn’t find anyone else experiencing such a slow rise and fall, I went ahead and did the float test since it was bubbly on top. It passed! My question is- since the rise and fall is ridiculously slow (and not common I’m guessing?), should I wait a few more days to “strengthen it” some more? Or do you think that won’t make a difference? At this rate, if I want to bake bread, I have to feed my starter about 15 hours or so before I want to start! Or is this a good thing because it means my window to use the starter in a recipe is huge? Based on everything I am observing, the starter is staying at it’s peak height for several hours.
In case it matters, I am using unbleached KA AP flour, warm tap water, and my starter is living in my pantry (still using the original feeding method of removing/discarding half of the starter and adding 60 g flour and 60 g water).
Thanks for all of your help- you are the sourdough QUEEN!!!
Emilie Raffa says
Oooo this is a great question. And to be honest, there is no right answer. It all depends on what you’re looking to achieve.
Here’s how I see it: if your starter is bubbly and passes the float test now, go ahead and use it. It’s ok that the rise is slow (and not that common- don’t worry about that). The most important thing here is that your starter is showing healthy signs of activity. That’s what you want!
Taking it a bit further: the more frequent you feed your starter, the stronger it will get and the faster it will rise. But if I were you, don’t start messing with that yet. Get to know your starter as it is now, play around with the rise and fall timings with your baking schedule (maybe that 15 hr window is a good thing is you’re busy?), and just take your time to get your feet wet. Practice through repetition is important. Then, based on your observations, you can increase the feeding frequencies if you want and take it from there.
Does that make sense? Hope so! I’d write more but my baby is strangling the cat in the other room… lol xx
Christine S says
Hello, I followed your Beginner Sourdough Starter recipe and after a couple of slow (and impatient!) weeks, it finally activated! I’d been feeding it using the same method in the starter recipe, where I’d removed half then add 60g flour + 60g water. At what point should I switch to the 1:1:1 ratio method discussed above?
Emilie Raffa says
Hi Christine! There are no hard and fast rules. If your starter is happy with the ratio you’re using now, you don’t have to change anything. If you’d like to switch to the 1:1:1 try it and see how it goes. It won’t hurt. Heads up: in the warm summer months regardless of the feeding ratios starters tend to become more runny and liquidy. Feel free to add extra flour to thicken it up. :)
Kathy says
I made bread dough last night, put it in a cooler with an ice pack for 1st rise, since it’s been very humid (the recipe said temp should be about 68*F). Got a little colder in the cooler, so I put it outside for 1\2 hour, still covered with plastic wrap. It looks like there is a slight orange streak on top of the dough. I didn’t see any orange streaks in the starter before I started making the bread dough. Is it safe to continue baking and eat? I made my starter 2 1/2 weeks ago with a different hydration level. It never really doubled in size. Since most recipes use 100% hydration, I started feeding it with that amount. The starter looked, rose, and smelled so much better, so after 3 days of feeding it at 100% hydration, I started making bread. (from the very beginning I never saw any orange streaks in the starter). Can the dough go bad if the starter is good?
Emilie Raffa says
Hi there! I’ve never heard of orange streaks on bread dough before, so I’m unable to advise with exact specifics.
However, is it possible that something accidentally fell onto the dough? Maybe something was stuck on the plastic wrap? For example, and this sounds so silly, but a dried cranberry fell in my sourdough starter once and the whole thing turned streaky pink! At the time, I had no clue what was going on until I found the cranberry at the bottom of the jar. You never know! Just a thought.
Additionally, bread dough doesn’t go bad. It’s not like milk. So, I don’t think your starter or the dough itself was the issue.
And one more thing: Rise times are based on temperature. Room temperature is usually 68 F or even 70 F. If this temperature range is not your room temperature (i.e. summer) you don’t need to put the dough in a cooler. I would just shorten the rise time.
Lynn says
I have an active GF (King Arthur) starter. I have read that if it’s ready to use, try the float test. Mine sank. It has a nice yeasty smell, it doubled in size from its feeding this AM. It’s over a month old. Should I see
Something different/float? Or does GF flour
respond differently??
Emilie Raffa says
Lynn, do the float test when your starter is at peak height. If you do it after it starts to collapse, it might sink (although it is active). Out of curiousity, does King Arthur specifically recommend the float test for GF starters?
Lisa says
My starter recipe said to use 2 Tbsp of starter add 1/4 C flour and 2 Tbsp of water and 2 tsp water, it doesn’t rise and it doesn’t float it’s been 9 days of feeding every 24 hrs. I have bubbles and a sweet aroma that’s it.
Geraldine Franklin says
Help I made bread last night and fed my starter and left on counter. This morning it was all over the counter and what was left in the jar was runny , I wanted to make bread today what do I do ? Discard all but 100 grams then feed it equal amounts of flour and water and wait for it to rise? I am new at this :)
Emilie Raffa says
Not to worry at all. Just feed what’s left in the jar (I’m assuming 100 g? ) with equal weights of flour and water and wait for it to rise. When it’s ready, you can make another batch of dough.
Geraldine Franklin says
Thank you so much for such a quick reply ! Sense I made bread last night should I have left my starter on the counter and waited until this morning to feed her? Then maybe she would not have made such a mess :)
Emilie Raffa says
Once you get to know your sourdough starter, you’ll have a better idea of how long it takes to rise. So for example, if your starter takes about 3 hrs. to double in warm weather, perhaps only feed it 3 hrs. before you want to make the dough. Does that make sense? This will help with the timing!
Marla K says
Hi Emilie!
I am making a starter with bread flour and although it has some bubbles and now smells lovely, it has not risen at all. I realized today that the flour I was using had a best used by date of 2017. Since it smells fine, I am not too concerned, but I wanted to know your thoughts on that. Continue on with fresh flour? Start over?
Thanks,
Marla
Emilie Raffa says
Fresh is always best. But given that you’ve just started the process, continue feeding it and see how it goes- you’ll never know otherwise!
Marla K says
It is now perfect. Patience is truly a virtue!!
Liv says
Hi, my sourdough starter always stops doubling in size on day 4 onwards and turns from pasty when I first feed it to runny (like thin pancake batter) after 24hrs when I’m about to feed it. No hooch ever forms also. Is it no longer active cos when it gets to day 4, I’m combining 90g starter with 60g fresh flour and 60g filtered water, Thus the feeding ratio is not 1:1:1? I have tried many times and it doesn’t rise to double at day 4 onwards.. :(
Emilie Raffa says
Liv, the feeding ratio is slightly different when you first create a starter vs. the ongoing feeding ratio of 1:1:1 you see on this post.
In your case, I would add more flour to your starter (than indicated in the beginner starter recipe) to make it thicker. Focus on achieving that thicker texture each day rather than the quantity. This will help with the rise. Hope this helps!
joe says
Thanks for the info. I do have a question. I made a gluten free sourdoudough starter and today is day 8. I am removing some each day and feeding it and it has been growing each time. I can see bubbles through the side of the jar but the bubbles dont seem to be breaking the surface on the top. Is that an issue? Should i try something else?
Emilie Raffa says
Not an issue at all. Just give it a stir to redistribute the air bubbles. Otherwise, it sounds active!
Lily W says
Hello! My starter has been healthy for six months, and something changed this week. It has a strong vinegar smell, and is not bubbling after feeds. I had it fairly consistently rising and have been successfully baking using it, but something has changed. I have not changed anything about it, although the weather has gotten warmer. We have had fruit flies, but im keeping the jar wrapped in mesh now to ward them off. I’m feeding twice a day to try to get it back on track, any other advice? Its been a very successful strong starter and if hate to lose it! Thank you!!
Chedia says
I have the exact same issue…My starter has been great and the smell was a very nice tangy one…But 2 days ago it changed to vinegary, although none of the conditions have changed…I don’t know if I can still use it. Any advice? Thanks!
Emilie Raffa says
This is normal. The vinegary smell just means you starter needs to be fed. It can still be used!
Margaret Michael says
Hi and thank you from Melbourne Australia! Day five and I forgot to divide and discard prior to adding the flour and water…. shall I toss it all out and restart or do the divide and discard tomorrow…? It’s looking lovely and bubbly though :)
Emilie Raffa says
No need to start over! The process is extremely flexible. Do it tomorrow and continue with the feedings. Might take a bit more time to become active, but this is ok.
Angela Boyer says
Oh this is just a fabulous website! Thanks for all the great information. Now I need your help. I fed my starter and left it out to activate for awhile. My plan was to make sourdough with the remainder but I accidentally forgot and used all my starter for the ‘big/poolish’.
so what do I do? Can I reconstitute it from the remnants of the jar with some additional water and flour or can I grab some of my rising dough and use that to refeed the starter solution I have remaining (by jar scrapings) Please help!!
Emilie Raffa says
Ooo! How much do you have left? At least a tablespoon? If so, that’s enough to save it. Just feed what’s left with a bit of flour and warm water. Fingers crossed!
Stephanie C says
Hi, I have your book, but I am wondering, is there a difference between active starter and discard? Your recipes always have the reminder to feed the starter after using. How does this work if I am generally feeding it every 24 hours? Thank you.
Emilie Raffa says
Yes! Bubbly, active starter is used to leaven the bread. The discard, which is the portion your remove before a feeding is not strong enough. When in good condition, the discard can be saved for other recipes like pancakes.
To use a starter for baking, feed it first and wait for it to become active. Then you can use it to make dough. After you scoop out what you need for your recipe, feed the starter again to keep the process going and to ensure you have enough for the next time you want to bake.
Alternatively, if you’re not baking feed it 1x per day if storing at room temperature.
Evan W says
I have made a German sourdough starter that consists of 3/4 cup unbleached flour, 2 tablespoons rye flour, a large pinch of yeast, and 1 cup of flat beer. When I feed it, should I be using just regular flour, or a mixture of regular and rye? Also, should I use water or flat beer? Very informative post, by the way!
Emilie Raffa says
Hi there! If your starter did not come with specific feeding instructions, it’s hard to say for sure. Personally, I’d feed it a mix of the two flours because it sounds like the addition of rye flour (and beer) is characteristic of this German-style starter. The beer is most likely used for flavor and to cultivate the yeast, so again, I’d use that for best results.
Now, if you find that these factors are not practical for everyday maintenance, split your starter into two jars. Feed one jar with the rye, ap flour & beer. Feed the other jar with ap flour and water. See which one you prefer.
Debbie says
I’m making an Amish Friendship bread starter which is yeast, flour, sugar and milk. I’ve added the second batch of above (without the yeast) but it is totally liquid.
The only thing I can think of is I used cold fat free milk. Should I start over?
Emilie Raffa says
Debbie, I wouldn’t start over. It just sounds like your starter needs more flour. Add a dash more and see what the texture looks like. This should help!
Lindsey says
If I’m adding 1cup flour and 1cup water this is leaving me with not very much space in jar, what should I do? I’m trying to feed until I get it to double
Emilie Raffa says
You can either use a larger jar OR scale down the quantity of starter you currently have, which will reduce the quantity of flour and water needed for the feedings.
Chris Furner says
If you are adding 1 cup of flour and 1 cup of water this is not a 1:1:1 ratio. Ratio should be by weight not volume.
Emilie Raffa says
Hi there! Yes: you are correct. This is already indicated in the post above :)
Emily says
Hi there fellow bakers!
My starter was consistently passing the float test but now even though it is doubling in height, it will not float. I have been using whole wheat flour but haven’t read that it should change the density so much to affect it floating…Help!
KIMBERLY JOYCE says
I am having the exact same problem. My starter has large bubbles, doubles in size but refuses to float. I have been using Kimg Arthur whole wheat flour. My starter is 5 months old and I have made several loaves with no issues until now….I have no idea how to correct the issue???
Emilie Raffa says
Do the float test when your starter is at peak height and not after it falls. Timing is most likely the issue.
Dana Therrian says
I’m super embarrassed to admit this but from what you’re saying half cup water measured in liquid measuring cup is not equal to half cup flour in a dry measuring cup so now I’m confused and not sure what to do from here? My starter instructions said half cup each… grams aren’t even listed to tip me off that I might have missed home economics…
Emilie Raffa says
Correct: 1/2 cup of water is not equal to 1/2 cup of flour. While the measuring cup amounts are the same (1/2 for each), the actual weight of each ingredient is different. I’m not sure about the starter instructions you’re following, but give it a go as written and see what happens. The feeding process is actually quite flexible once you get the hang of it and know what to look for.
Teri says
My first day of making the starter but after a few hours, it overflowed maybe 1/3 of it. Should I add more flour on the 2nd day? Thanks.
Kiran Roye says
I made my starter with AP Flour and filtered water (I don’t have access to any other flours) so far it seems to be doing good, I’ve used it in various recipes and it seems to work. But it doesn’t double, it bubbles a lot and it does form hooch if I forget to feed it on schedule, so i know there is stuff in it, but it doesn’t bubble, is it good to use in a sourdough?
nick says
It probably just needs more time before it’s active enough for bread. You’ll know it’s active enough because a small piece of it’ll float in water.
Anon says
My starter is 17 days old. The volume is not increasing much, maybe 5 to 20% after each feeding. I feed it twice every day, and it sits in a very warm room. I had active yeast on the third day, starting with pineapple juice and whole grain unbleached King Arthur wheat flour, I could smell it and see it. When I then switched to tap water (which is > 95% of what I drink), activity gradually, slowly died down, day by day. Never completely, but there was not a whole lot to begin with, either. The smell also gradually got worse, and eventually I was concerned that there might not even be any active yeast left. I was expecting that the volume would begin raising significantly after each feeding, once I had active yeast. I did some research and learned that the amount of chloramines put into the water varies throughout the year, usually more in the summer time (which it is). Sometimes, I can smell the chlorine products in the water.
It never improved, so I switched to wal-mart brand (Great Value) gallon jug of spring water on the 11th day, which the label leads me to believe is not treated with chlorine/ammonia. All activity pretty much immediately ceased. Also, I found that this water tastes much worse than the tap water, it tastes like plastic (which I imagine is probably dangerously toxic), so I doubt it would make good bread anyway, I think I’ll have to find yet another option eventually and dump these jugs of water.
The next day, I switched back to pineapple juice. The day after that, the volume nearly doubled, for the first time! Exciting and validating. This leads me to believe that my method is fine, the environment is fine, the flour is fine, the problem must be the water, but until I find something that sustainably works I can’t know for sure what works and what causes problems.
The next day, I switched back to Great Value spring water. 7 hours later, it seemed again to be completely dead. Another 5 hours, and there are some bubbles and hooch on the surface, and it seems that I’m back where I started. A little activity, tiny bubbles, very thin hooch layer, almost no rising. Perhaps there is a guaranteed adjustment period when switching liquids, where strain selection and behaviors need time to shift in response. There seems to be yeast activity, but not nearly as much as I’ve read that there should be. Two more days later, still the same.
Am I doing something wrong? Is it possible that I don’t even have active yeast? Do I need to just keep feeding and waiting as all these articles say, expecting it to suddenly improve eventually? The fact that I had yeast on day 3, and significant volume increase just one day after switching back to juice later, makes me think I’m supposed to see faster results. I’m assuming that this isn’t good enough to make bread with, but maybe this is what this particular starter is ‘supposed to be’ and I should have been making bread this whole time? The rational part of me says the water is still the problem. But if there’s no chlorine in this water, why is it giving exactly the same results as the tap water? I’ve read the yeast/lactobacillus ecosystem can tolerate some chlorine, and most chlorinated tap water is fine. If it tastes good to me, shouldn’t the tap water levels have been low enough for the yeast? What is going on?
Nancy Soule says
Just boil your tap water and let it sit overnight. The Chlorine will evaporate and you will be left with perfectly acceptable feeding water.
Tradori says
I use water tap water that is filtered through a brita pitcher. I keep a bottle on my counter so that it is at room temp. I had a similar issue but mine was with flour. I started with the wheat flour. Then when I switched to all purpose activity died. So I had to gradually switch. The next feeding I used mostly wheat with a couple if spoons of all purpose mixed in. I gradually switched to all purpose. Now it’s going great. Maybe a gradual shift from juice to water is what you need until you are only using water.
Adi says
Very Interesting! Because I started with whole wheat flour and from day one I had great activity. Day 2 I continued with whole wheat and saw a lot of activity. Day 3,4,5 I switched to all purpose flour and its more or less radio silence. Just the odd bubble here or there but nothing like the first two days. Maybe I need to add back some whole wheat and see if that helps. Thanks for the idea.
Jennifer says
Hi. I love the information you have shared and have enjoyed the first two loaves I have made. I have been bulk rising my bread in the refrigerator over night. When i get it out 12 hours later it does not appear to have risen much. It certainly does not double in size. My bread has been tasty but I just wondered if I need to let it sit out for a few hours after I take it out of the fridge before cooking?
Sonora says
I have always been taught to bulk rise covered at room temp for 12 hours – the fridge is too cold for it to rise. If after 12 hours I’m not ready to do the second rise, I put my dough in the fridge to stop the rising. The fridge is too cold for your yeast to actively grow much, hence why you use the fridge to stop the rise. Hope this helps!
WP says
My starter is on day 14 today and it is still runny.
It doubles up and collapses with 1x feeding daily.
It is bubbling, but runny. How do I tell if it is ready to use or I can now move it to the fridge?
Dustin says
If it is doubling up and collapsing, but too runny to scoop out a chunk to do the float test, then you are probably adding too much water / too little flour. Make the next batch a little thicker.
Also, when it doubles up, it will thin out significantly. The yeast and lacto lactobacteria are eating the flour and they produce liquids in the process. That is normal.
Anyway, yours is probably ready. With a thicker batch, as soon as it has doubled, do the float test. If it floats, you should immediately use the starter to make some bread. You need to use it before it starts to collapse back down for best results.
wp says
thank you dustin. I did a 60%flour and 40% water to thicken up my starter. It is super active now ☺️
Amy says
Thank you so much for this informative site! I’m a beginner at this and have a question…I see some of your recipes require varying amounts of starter. Some of them would take more starter than I have ended up with after following the 7 day process of creating a starter. Do you feed the starter with double or more amounts of flour and water ahead of time so you have enough to bake with and still have some reserve?
Antje Ruppert says
Thank you for your words of comfort and encouragement. I have been working on sourdough baking for a couple of months now and have had some good and some not so great bread baking results. Currently my starter, which usually lives in the fridge when I am not baking, is having rising issues. I took it out two evenings ago and fed it, and have since fed it 3 more times. My question: do you typically feed your starter before transferring it back into the fridge after having taken out what you needed for your dough, or do you wait with the next feeding until you take it out again? Could you kindly reply to my email address (antje@sover.net)?
Thank you,
Antje
Kylla says
Fruit Flies……..
I use a simple fruit fly trap. Take a glass jar, and poke holes in the lid. I have also just used a coffee cup with no cover. Place a few tablespoons of attractant. I use red wine vinegar, I have found it works the best. You can also try wine, juice, apple cider vinegar. Add a few drops of dish soap, and mix. The dish soap will stick to their wings so that they can not fly, and they will drown in the liquid. I place mine on my window sill, above my kitchen sink.
stephan richards says
hey everyone im stephan from falls church, VA. And i started my first batch of sour dough starter. i am currently making 2 batches to experiment to see which ones of the two work better for the environment i am in. i have a 50/50 bread flour and whole wheat flour going and one only using bread flour. im on day 14 of the wholewheat/bread flour starter and day 20 of the bread flour starter. just 4 days ago i changed from a 100g bread flour 100g mineral water and 75g of reserved starter, and 50g whole wheat flour 50g bread flour 100g mineral water and 75g of reserved starter. in both batches im seeing Zero rise but i am seeing tiny sporadic bubbles on the sides of glass jar and a few bubbles on top. on the jar with wheat flour/bread flour the bubbles on the side are more prominent.
my question…..what am i doing wrong. im seeing no rise at all and its becoming kinda expensive to keep buying flour (by the way the flour is unbleached)? what would your recommend for me to do? im currently doing 2 feedings a day, every 10-12 hours.
Shannon says
How to best time feeding starter in relation to making bread? Like, if I plan to start bread at 7:00pm, should the starter be in the peak of a rise? Already risen and fallen? Just after feeding?thanks.
Emilie Raffa says
To make bread, your starter needs to double in volume, so using it at peak height is best. For timing, you have to know how long it takes for your starter to become active first. For example, if it takes 4 hrs. feed it at approximately at 3 PM to start mixing the dough by 7 PM.
Susan says
Really useful. I’ve been having issues with things moving too slowly and your post prompted me to dig out my old yoghurt maker to regular the temperature. Fingers crossed!
Melissa says
Hi! I have 2 starters going right now. One is AP flour and the other is rye. I can see the AP flour rise after feeding, but the rye isn’t rising. It does have a fruity smell (my husband says apples) so I think it is still good. It does have the bubbles also before feeding. Is it still good? Thank you for the article, calmed my nerves about a lot of questions!
Robin says
What is my sourdough starter is made with rye flour and it bubbles in doubles but it doesn’t pass the float test? It’s about 2 1/2 weeks old. Is it safe to use and start a loaf of bread?
Angela says
Hi there!
Your instructions are really thorough and helpful, so thank you so much. I am currently on day four of my starter and was excited to see that it had expanded and bubbled throughout. I read that the starter should be stirred intermittently to help equally distribute the yeast, and went ahead and did so, and now my mixture has sort of deflated a bit and the bubbles have mostly disappeared. I have a couple more hours before feeding time… should I give it a rest and let it return to how it was before, or should I feed it now?
Thank you so much!
Tom says
Don’t worry about the starter deflating so much, by stirring it you released the CO2 bubbles that were trapped. The yeast is just fine!